= Well said Ronald. You got my support on this. Did not like the way it = came across as if Windows servers sucks for WebDNA. I am sure that was = not the intent. May be the meaning got lost during translation. Oh = well.
=
= Cheers TDn
=
From:= = Ronald Kirkland [mailto:rwkirkland@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, = July 11, 2011 04:00
To: talk@webdna.us
Subject: Re: = [WebDNA] An unknown error occured // Deadlock = avoided
I forgot to include on #4, What version = of WebDNA are you using?
On Sun, = Jul 10, 2011 at 12:58 PM, Ronald Kirkland <rwkirkland@gmail.com> = wrote:
Ok, I was not going to respond = to this message as I had nothing to really contribute, but the response = that the developer should migrate to a different server environment to = fix an issue he is having with a programming language that was purchased = (and does have a windows version) is insane. What makes this worse is = that Chris suggested it. I am extremely shocked at this and a little = concerned.
Ken you asked him why he could not migrate? Besides = the "he shouldn't have to," if he is at a company of any size, = there is typically many logistical issues that would have to be = overcome. Server farms, IT department being MS certified (not *nix = people), cost of a new Linux license for a language that is already = giving them troubles, to just name a few.
Now, I have run WebDNA = on Linux, Mac, and Windows since I began using it (when I was hired at = SmithMicro back in 99). All the servers have offered hurdles that had to = be overcome at one time or another. I was running WebDNA on a windows = server until just about a year ago and it had worked fine for = years.
Threatening to move to another language to fix the issue = is not obviously the best way to get support for a product that you are = having issues with. Nor is telling the people who are using it that = their language is not good enough or powerful enough to run enterprise = level apps. I have built some extremely large and complex applications = using WebDNA for many LARGE companies (Boeing, Honeywell, Pillsbury, = etc.). And for the record I am at this very moment dealing with a = massive PHP project that is having issues. And in the past I have run = into the same type of issues with ColdFusion, .Net, and Perl. So = none of the languages are perfect or error proof.
I think our = time would be a little better spent looking at what could actually cause = these issues rather than bashing the language or server choices. =
Tom, I know it can difficult to share code when it is = technically the IP of the company you work for, but there is not always = a blanket reason for something to fail. There are too many variables = that can come into play (write permissions, drivers, registry = constraints, etc.).
Some suggestions and questions to help you = and possibly help us help you:
1. Does this happen every time you = attempt to write to that specific database(s)?
2. Is it always the = same database(s)?
3. Write a simple script that is not accessed via = the app to write test data to the database(s). Does this work or do you = get the same error?
4. Give us more info about the = environment:
- Windows version (please include = service pack too)
- IIS, Apache, something else? = (give versions please)
5. Are other apps using the same files or = directories?
6. Try stepping through the code and see if this is only = happening after a specific task is executed.
I am in agreement = with Ken that this seems to be a configuration issue or an errant code. = I am not going to blame this on the old developer, but perhaps something = changed and the app is expecting A and getting B. We just cannot know at = this time.
Best of luck!
Ron
On Sun, Jul 10, 2011 at 5:13 AM, Kenneth Grome <kengrome@gmail.com> wrote:
What is the URL to the website you're having all = these
problems with?
What is the URL to the admin system = you've been referring
to?
Yes I know we do not have a = username/password to use it --
but I still want to see it so I know = whether you're talking
about a system I'm familiar with, or one that = someone built
as a custom admin system for your = server.
> No, the reason is that the = entire architecture is
> designed around windows systems - there = are tons of
> things running on the server that require windows, = we
> are thoughouly tied into windows.
You could redirect all http requests to the new Linux = server
while keeping everything else running on your = existing
Windows server. Do you know how to do this? If = so, are you
willing to do this as your FIRST attempt to get the = problem
resolved? Or is this something you are willing to try = after
you've tried other approaches to solve the problem? Or = are
you simply not willing to try this at all?
> Now we = could get another machine to run just the
> webserver on but the = way the system is designed /
> implemented, that would mean I = would have to
> change all places where webdna refers to the = servers
WebDNA does not refer = to other servers, it only works with
the files on the server it is = installed on.
Or are you talking about changing a bunch of http = paths?
This sounds like a 5 minute change via UltraEdit "search = and
replace in files" if you ask me. Or maybe this would = take an
hour or two -- which should still be no big deal in terms = of
the value of actually getting the problem resolved, = right?
Unfortunately you still haven't answered any of my = other
questions so I get the feeling that you're not = really
serious about getting WebDNA fixed anyways. If this is = true
then please tell us that you've given up on WebDNA so = we
don't waste any more time trying to help you.
Otherwise = will you please just give us the URLs I asked for
above? Your = answers to these questions would be a good way
to help us help you, = too:
> > What is your "plan = of action"?
> > Have you tried to reboot the = server yet to see if that
> > clears up the = problems???
> > What are you telling this admin = panel to do?
> > What "admin panel" = are you talking about? The
> > WebDNA admin panel that = came with the WebDNA software,
> > or a separate programmer's = admin panel? Or some other
> > admin = panel?
> > How are you = deleting the probematic database file?
> > Via an admin panel button or = link?
> > Are you flushing the databases = first
> > BEFORE deleting = the database file?
> = > How is WebDNA "making a new
> > db" if you are = deleting the existing db?
> > What is it using to populate = this new db?
Sincerely,
Kenneth = Grome
---------------------------------------------------------
Thi= s message is sent to you because you are subscribed to
the mailing = list <talk@webdna.us>.
To unsubscribe, E-mail to: = <talk-leave@webdna.us>
archives: http://mail.webdna.us/list/talk@webdna.us
Bug = Reporting: support@webdna.us
---------------------------------------------------= ------ This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the = mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: archives: = http://mail.webdna.us/list/talk@webdna.us Bug Reporting: = support@webdna.us
= Well said Ronald. You got my support on this. Did not like the way it = came across as if Windows servers sucks for WebDNA. I am sure that was = not the intent. May be the meaning got lost during translation. Oh = well.
=
= Cheers TDn
=
From:= = Ronald Kirkland [mailto:rwkirkland@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, = July 11, 2011 04:00
To: talk@webdna.us
Subject: Re: = [WebDNA] An unknown error occured // Deadlock = avoided
I forgot to include on #4, What version = of WebDNA are you using?
On Sun, = Jul 10, 2011 at 12:58 PM, Ronald Kirkland <rwkirkland@gmail.com> = wrote:
Ok, I was not going to respond = to this message as I had nothing to really contribute, but the response = that the developer should migrate to a different server environment to = fix an issue he is having with a programming language that was purchased = (and does have a windows version) is insane. What makes this worse is = that Chris suggested it. I am extremely shocked at this and a little = concerned.
Ken you asked him why he could not migrate? Besides = the "he shouldn't have to," if he is at a company of any size, = there is typically many logistical issues that would have to be = overcome. Server farms, IT department being MS certified (not *nix = people), cost of a new Linux license for a language that is already = giving them troubles, to just name a few.
Now, I have run WebDNA = on Linux, Mac, and Windows since I began using it (when I was hired at = SmithMicro back in 99). All the servers have offered hurdles that had to = be overcome at one time or another. I was running WebDNA on a windows = server until just about a year ago and it had worked fine for = years.
Threatening to move to another language to fix the issue = is not obviously the best way to get support for a product that you are = having issues with. Nor is telling the people who are using it that = their language is not good enough or powerful enough to run enterprise = level apps. I have built some extremely large and complex applications = using WebDNA for many LARGE companies (Boeing, Honeywell, Pillsbury, = etc.). And for the record I am at this very moment dealing with a = massive PHP project that is having issues. And in the past I have run = into the same type of issues with ColdFusion, .Net, and Perl. So = none of the languages are perfect or error proof.
I think our = time would be a little better spent looking at what could actually cause = these issues rather than bashing the language or server choices. =
Tom, I know it can difficult to share code when it is = technically the IP of the company you work for, but there is not always = a blanket reason for something to fail. There are too many variables = that can come into play (write permissions, drivers, registry = constraints, etc.).
Some suggestions and questions to help you = and possibly help us help you:
1. Does this happen every time you = attempt to write to that specific database(s)?
2. Is it always the = same database(s)?
3. Write a simple script that is not accessed via = the app to write test data to the database(s). Does this work or do you = get the same error?
4. Give us more info about the = environment:
- Windows version (please include = service pack too)
- IIS, Apache, something else? = (give versions please)
5. Are other apps using the same files or = directories?
6. Try stepping through the code and see if this is only = happening after a specific task is executed.
I am in agreement = with Ken that this seems to be a configuration issue or an errant code. = I am not going to blame this on the old developer, but perhaps something = changed and the app is expecting A and getting B. We just cannot know at = this time.
Best of luck!
Ron
On Sun, Jul 10, 2011 at 5:13 AM, Kenneth Grome <kengrome@gmail.com> wrote:
What is the URL to the website you're having all = these
problems with?
What is the URL to the admin system = you've been referring
to?
Yes I know we do not have a = username/password to use it --
but I still want to see it so I know = whether you're talking
about a system I'm familiar with, or one that = someone built
as a custom admin system for your = server.
> No, the reason is that the = entire architecture is
> designed around windows systems - there = are tons of
> things running on the server that require windows, = we
> are thoughouly tied into windows.
You could redirect all http requests to the new Linux = server
while keeping everything else running on your = existing
Windows server. Do you know how to do this? If = so, are you
willing to do this as your FIRST attempt to get the = problem
resolved? Or is this something you are willing to try = after
you've tried other approaches to solve the problem? Or = are
you simply not willing to try this at all?
> Now we = could get another machine to run just the
> webserver on but the = way the system is designed /
> implemented, that would mean I = would have to
> change all places where webdna refers to the = servers
WebDNA does not refer = to other servers, it only works with
the files on the server it is = installed on.
Or are you talking about changing a bunch of http = paths?
This sounds like a 5 minute change via UltraEdit "search = and
replace in files" if you ask me. Or maybe this would = take an
hour or two -- which should still be no big deal in terms = of
the value of actually getting the problem resolved, = right?
Unfortunately you still haven't answered any of my = other
questions so I get the feeling that you're not = really
serious about getting WebDNA fixed anyways. If this is = true
then please tell us that you've given up on WebDNA so = we
don't waste any more time trying to help you.
Otherwise = will you please just give us the URLs I asked for
above? Your = answers to these questions would be a good way
to help us help you, = too:
> > What is your "plan = of action"?
> > Have you tried to reboot the = server yet to see if that
> > clears up the = problems???
> > What are you telling this admin = panel to do?
> > What "admin panel" = are you talking about? The
> > WebDNA admin panel that = came with the WebDNA software,
> > or a separate programmer's = admin panel? Or some other
> > admin = panel?
> > How are you = deleting the probematic database file?
> > Via an admin panel button or = link?
> > Are you flushing the databases = first
> > BEFORE deleting = the database file?
> = > How is WebDNA "making a new
> > db" if you are = deleting the existing db?
> > What is it using to populate = this new db?
Sincerely,
Kenneth = Grome
---------------------------------------------------------
Thi= s message is sent to you because you are subscribed to
the mailing = list <talk@webdna.us>.
To unsubscribe, E-mail to: = <talk-leave@webdna.us>
archives: http://mail.webdna.us/list/talk@webdna.us
Bug = Reporting: support@webdna.us
---------------------------------------------------= ------ This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the = mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: archives: = http://mail.webdna.us/list/talk@webdna.us Bug Reporting: = support@webdna.us
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