Re: WebDNA Feature Request
This WebDNA talk-list message is from 2006
It keeps the original formatting.
numero = 67785
interpreted = N
texte = Hi John As much as I respect your opinions most of the time I have to disagree here. PHP and ColdFusion and probably others have exactly this abstraction layer to connect my application to any data source I want. We as web developers only have to select the data source and that's it. All of my code still works as expected and there is no need to reconfigure my application. No need to setup a ODBC connection or configuration or anything (try to get it working on MacOS X and you know what I mean). Plus if you hook up WebDNA to be able to "talk" to the database over JDBC then the developers at SMSI don't have to code the driver themselves! On the CEO or marketing talk I have tried to sell my applications with WebDNA many times and have failed a lot of times because of the technology part. Everything was fine, but the "WebDNA does not talk to any other database natively then MySQL (at the moment)" was not a very confident way to sell a solution. Customers want a proven and reliable system which scales with their needs. Sure, this is all marketing talk and most of them change the system before they even move forward or whatever, but still you need to show that you can do it. Again if you say it all works with ODBC is fine, but most developers and technical persons I have talked to, they look at you like a dinosaur. Again it all depends to who you are talking to. If you have customers which already own Oracle or MS SQL then your solution needs to talk to them (again depending on your solution). Here in Switzerland a lot of companies got MS SQL and Oracle running. So for us this is a must have. Might be different in your part and with your clients. But still, I stand to the point that WebDNA, if it wants to stay among the PHP/ColdFusion/Perl/name your favorite here languages it needs to at least come up to the standard of those languages. Nitai John Peacock wrote: > Nitai @ ComputerOil wrote: >> 1. Major Database support build in. Connect natively to Oracle, DB2, >> MS SQL. > > WebDNA already has ODBC support. What are you expecting native > drivers to cost to develop? Here's a hint: it's really hard to bind > to multiple databases with native drivers; you wind up building an > abstraction layer which winds up just duplicating ODBC (as pathetic as > *that* is). It's a big distraction from features that everyone will use. > >> As long as we can't connect to other systems, WebDNA can not compete >> with other systems. Flat file is nice and fast, but you can't argue with >> a CEO and lack of SQL support. > > Sure I can. All I have to do is point out the cost of Oracle (per CPU > or per seat) or MS SQL (per connection plus per server?). Your > licensing cost depends on your traffic, whereas right now your > licensing is flat with regards to traffic. If you already have an > enterprise SQL solution, you already have staff to support the > database (which is not something that HTML jockeys should attempt). > But, an experienced Oracle DBA is $120k per year in my market, so a > free database usually beats out a commercial one for most purposes. > > John > -- eBusines Suites simplified. eContentPark - Enterprise Digital Asset Management free of charge eServices - The complete SupportSuite eSurvey - Online Questionnaire made easy Redakto CMS - Content Management that simply works ComputerOil® AG Neugutstrasse 66 8600 Dübendorf / Switzerland Telefon +41 (0)844 44 55 66 info@computeroil.com http://computeroil.com http://econtentpark.com ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list
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Associated Messages, from the most recent to the oldest:
Hi John As much as I respect your opinions most of the time I have to disagree here. PHP and ColdFusion and probably others have exactly this abstraction layer to connect my application to any data source I want. We as web developers only have to select the data source and that's it. All of my code still works as expected and there is no need to reconfigure my application. No need to setup a ODBC connection or configuration or anything (try to get it working on MacOS X and you know what I mean). Plus if you hook up WebDNA to be able to "talk" to the database over JDBC then the developers at SMSI don't have to code the driver themselves! On the CEO or marketing talk I have tried to sell my applications with WebDNA many times and have failed a lot of times because of the technology part. Everything was fine, but the "WebDNA does not talk to any other database natively then MySQL (at the moment)" was not a very confident way to sell a solution. Customers want a proven and reliable system which scales with their needs. Sure, this is all marketing talk and most of them change the system before they even move forward or whatever, but still you need to show that you can do it. Again if you say it all works with ODBC is fine, but most developers and technical persons I have talked to, they look at you like a dinosaur. Again it all depends to who you are talking to. If you have customers which already own Oracle or MS SQL then your solution needs to talk to them (again depending on your solution). Here in Switzerland a lot of companies got MS SQL and Oracle running. So for us this is a must have. Might be different in your part and with your clients. But still, I stand to the point that WebDNA, if it wants to stay among the PHP/ColdFusion/Perl/name your favorite here languages it needs to at least come up to the standard of those languages. Nitai John Peacock wrote: > Nitai @ ComputerOil wrote: >> 1. Major Database support build in. Connect natively to Oracle, DB2, >> MS SQL. > > WebDNA already has ODBC support. What are you expecting native > drivers to cost to develop? Here's a hint: it's really hard to bind > to multiple databases with native drivers; you wind up building an > abstraction layer which winds up just duplicating ODBC (as pathetic as > *that* is). It's a big distraction from features that everyone will use. > >> As long as we can't connect to other systems, WebDNA can not compete >> with other systems. Flat file is nice and fast, but you can't argue with >> a CEO and lack of SQL support. > > Sure I can. All I have to do is point out the cost of Oracle (per CPU > or per seat) or MS SQL (per connection plus per server?). Your > licensing cost depends on your traffic, whereas right now your > licensing is flat with regards to traffic. If you already have an > enterprise SQL solution, you already have staff to support the > database (which is not something that HTML jockeys should attempt). > But, an experienced Oracle DBA is $120k per year in my market, so a > free database usually beats out a commercial one for most purposes. > > John > -- eBusines Suites simplified. eContentPark - Enterprise Digital Asset Management free of charge eServices - The complete SupportSuite eSurvey - Online Questionnaire made easy Redakto CMS - Content Management that simply works ComputerOil® AG Neugutstrasse 66 8600 Dübendorf / Switzerland Telefon +41 (0)844 44 55 66 info@computeroil.com http://computeroil.com http://econtentpark.com ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/
"Nitai @ ComputerOil"
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