Re: [WebDNA] Open source WebDNA?
This WebDNA talk-list message is from 2012
It keeps the original formatting.
numero = 107956
interpreted = N
texte = Just my two cents on this topic... I've using webdna for years.. not real vocal on the list but I and love webdna. I consider myself stronger towards the web design side than the web programming side but webdna makes it possible for me to do 90% of what most of my web clients want to do myself, plus more as I learn more and have time to experiment. The hurdle for me...server config. A virtual hosting flow that would handle this for me would kill especially to other web designers who want to do more backend work and expand their businesses. Add a free developer version to learn from along with a basic tutorials and examples, show them PHP+MYSQL=3DWEBDNA and you might sell some licenses. Dave __________ On Mon, Jan 2, 2012 at 12:19 PM, C. Frank Wolfe
wrote: > A VMware appliance would be great. =A0There are so many virtual hosting p= roviders one could pick from, and you are right, no installation at all. = =A0Great idea. > > frank > > > On Jan 2, 2012, at 4:12 AM, Chris Van Dromme wrote: > >> I have been developing websites using WebDNA on Windows since version 3.= I love it and I really hoping you have success in building a larger custom= er base. >> >> But I would like to point out that according to several web traffic surv= eys that I reviewed, Windows market share in the web server space is estima= ted anywhere between 25 and 40%. The 90% figure for Unix I believe is an ou= t-of-date assumption; a figure that UNIX has not had for over a decade. >> >> Unix is still the larger market, so you may be correct in pursuing it fi= rst. But you mention getting "new blood, young programmers, designers, webm= asters" interested in WebDNA. Many of these types are not interested in UNI= X. In looking at the graphs of market share, the overall trend for the last= decade is an increase in Windows and less reliance on UNIX. Apache has fal= len to just under 50% for Fortune 500 companies. >> >> I used to run both Linux and Windows servers. But the server administrat= ion became overwhelming. So I dropped the Linux because I had to have Windo= ws for certain applications. >> >> So I do hope eventually there is enough money it for you to continue wit= h a Windows version. >> >> I would like to make one suggestion regarding installation. I have been = running VMWare on all my servers for about a year and a half. Having an app= liance template that I could just boot up would make it a no brainer to try= it as far as I am concerned. They are becoming very popular and make it so= easy for someone to try it out with spending a minute configuring it. >> >> Chris >> US Internet >> >> On Jan 1, 2012, at 4:33 PM, christophe.billiottet@webdna.us wrote: >> >>> Just a few words: SmithMicro sold WebDNA for a lot of money. We, the in= vestors, paid this because we believe WebDNA has a future. Without us, WebD= NA would probably be in a box in a SmithMicro basement. >>> The initial investment and budget has been spent in less than a year, m= aybe not as wisely as it should have been. We started to please the communi= ty by releasing 6.2 as a free upgrade to 6.0 users. Then we thought the com= munity would buy enough new licenses to keep the ball rolling, but this has= proved to be wrong: support from the community has been scarse. Marketing?= no money left, so we got help from Dan Strong to redesign the site, but ev= en the most strident supporters will not accept to work for free forever. >>> >>> WebDNA needs a new start, a new customer background, it needs to be eve= n easier to learn and to use, it needs to be available for as many users as= possible, it needs to attract new blood, young programmers, designers, web= masters: to do this, i released WebDNA 7.0 FastCGI as a freeware, with opti= on to buy very cheap accelerator certificates. WebDNA 7.0 can now run on al= most any linux/unix webserver, with any webserver software. >>> >>> Windows? i prioritize Unix as it is the leader in serving the Web. Abou= t 90% of the Internet relies on Unix operating systems. Windows version is = an entirely different baby and we do not have -at this time- the available = skills or funds to work on it, for a 10% market share. >>> >>> Make it open source and WebDNA will be dead. Why? because no C++ progra= mmers has any interest in spending hundred of hours for free. >>> >>> So, if you can now use WebDNA with any modern UNIX/LINUX OS for free or= for an extremely low cost, it is because there is a tiny group of two peop= le working on it: the developer and me. >>> >>> I maybe stubborn, but i stick with my plan and i pay for it, from my ow= n money, and hope to be able to invest more soon. >>> >>> Any better idea is welcome. >>> >>> - chris >>> >>> On Jan 1, 2012, at 18:02, Kenneth Grome wrote: >>> >>>>> But then I saw the recent email about lack of funds to >>>>> work on the Windows version of WebDNA and the license >>>>> sale/promotion offered and the very real need for >>>>> funding for WebDNA. =A0At that point, it struck me that >>>>> maybe WebDNA was never going to be open source after >>>>> all. =A0Did I miss something? >>>> >>>> Yes, apparently you did. >>>> >>>> No one at WSC ever thought that open source was a wise thing >>>> to do. =A0From the very beginning they have felt that the only >>>> worthwhile asset they own is WebDNA's internal code -- and >>>> they need to prevent others from gaining access it at all >>>> costs. >>>> >>>> Case in point: >>>> >>>> Several years ago while I was still managing an offshore >>>> programming service and WSC had just purchased WebDNA I >>>> proposed to help them develop and release a new version "in >>>> record time" by setting up a special secured office and >>>> personally managing 5 full-time C++ programmers -- all for >>>> less than the cost of hiring one full-time US-based >>>> programmer with the same skill set. >>>> >>>> They rejected my offer because they did not trust me or my >>>> programmers (I'm not sure which, maybe all of us) to have >>>> access to WebDNA's internal code. >>>> >>>> It's been a few years since then. =A0I wonder how WSC's >>>> feelings may have changed? =A0To put it bluntly, if their >>>> attitude remains the same then it seems we have nothing to >>>> discuss. >>>> >>>> Sincerely, >>>> Kenneth Grome >>>> --------------------------------------------------------- >>>> This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to >>>> the mailing list . >>>> To unsubscribe, E-mail to: >>>> archives: http://mail.webdna.us/list/talk@webdna.us >>>> Bug Reporting: support@webdna.us >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------- >>> This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to >>> the mailing list . >>> To unsubscribe, E-mail to: >>> archives: http://mail.webdna.us/list/talk@webdna.us >>> Bug Reporting: support@webdna.us >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------- >> This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to >> the mailing list . >> To unsubscribe, E-mail to: >> archives: http://mail.webdna.us/list/talk@webdna.us >> Bug Reporting: support@webdna.us >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------- > This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to > the mailing list . > To unsubscribe, E-mail to: > archives: http://mail.webdna.us/list/talk@webdna.us > Bug Reporting: support@webdna.us --=20 Dave Stengel http://www.mobilinksoftware.com 209.820.1300 dave@mobilinkpro.com
Associated Messages, from the most recent to the oldest:
Just my two cents on this topic... I've using webdna for years.. not real vocal on the list but I and love webdna. I consider myself stronger towards the web design side than the web programming side but webdna makes it possible for me to do 90% of what most of my web clients want to do myself, plus more as I learn more and have time to experiment. The hurdle for me...server config. A virtual hosting flow that would handle this for me would kill especially to other web designers who want to do more backend work and expand their businesses. Add a free developer version to learn from along with a basic tutorials and examples, show them PHP+MYSQL=3DWEBDNA and you might sell some licenses. Dave __________ On Mon, Jan 2, 2012 at 12:19 PM, C. Frank Wolfe wrote: > A VMware appliance would be great. =A0There are so many virtual hosting p= roviders one could pick from, and you are right, no installation at all. = =A0Great idea. > > frank > > > On Jan 2, 2012, at 4:12 AM, Chris Van Dromme wrote: > >> I have been developing websites using WebDNA on Windows since version 3.= I love it and I really hoping you have success in building a larger custom= er base. >> >> But I would like to point out that according to several web traffic surv= eys that I reviewed, Windows market share in the web server space is estima= ted anywhere between 25 and 40%. The 90% figure for Unix I believe is an ou= t-of-date assumption; a figure that UNIX has not had for over a decade. >> >> Unix is still the larger market, so you may be correct in pursuing it fi= rst. But you mention getting "new blood, young programmers, designers, webm= asters" interested in WebDNA. Many of these types are not interested in UNI= X. In looking at the graphs of market share, the overall trend for the last= decade is an increase in Windows and less reliance on UNIX. Apache has fal= len to just under 50% for Fortune 500 companies. >> >> I used to run both Linux and Windows servers. But the server administrat= ion became overwhelming. So I dropped the Linux because I had to have Windo= ws for certain applications. >> >> So I do hope eventually there is enough money it for you to continue wit= h a Windows version. >> >> I would like to make one suggestion regarding installation. I have been = running VMWare on all my servers for about a year and a half. Having an app= liance template that I could just boot up would make it a no brainer to try= it as far as I am concerned. They are becoming very popular and make it so= easy for someone to try it out with spending a minute configuring it. >> >> Chris >> US Internet >> >> On Jan 1, 2012, at 4:33 PM, christophe.billiottet@webdna.us wrote: >> >>> Just a few words: SmithMicro sold WebDNA for a lot of money. We, the in= vestors, paid this because we believe WebDNA has a future. Without us, WebD= NA would probably be in a box in a SmithMicro basement. >>> The initial investment and budget has been spent in less than a year, m= aybe not as wisely as it should have been. We started to please the communi= ty by releasing 6.2 as a free upgrade to 6.0 users. Then we thought the com= munity would buy enough new licenses to keep the ball rolling, but this has= proved to be wrong: support from the community has been scarse. Marketing?= no money left, so we got help from Dan Strong to redesign the site, but ev= en the most strident supporters will not accept to work for free forever. >>> >>> WebDNA needs a new start, a new customer background, it needs to be eve= n easier to learn and to use, it needs to be available for as many users as= possible, it needs to attract new blood, young programmers, designers, web= masters: to do this, i released WebDNA 7.0 FastCGI as a freeware, with opti= on to buy very cheap accelerator certificates. WebDNA 7.0 can now run on al= most any linux/unix webserver, with any webserver software. >>> >>> Windows? i prioritize Unix as it is the leader in serving the Web. Abou= t 90% of the Internet relies on Unix operating systems. Windows version is = an entirely different baby and we do not have -at this time- the available = skills or funds to work on it, for a 10% market share. >>> >>> Make it open source and WebDNA will be dead. Why? because no C++ progra= mmers has any interest in spending hundred of hours for free. >>> >>> So, if you can now use WebDNA with any modern UNIX/LINUX OS for free or= for an extremely low cost, it is because there is a tiny group of two peop= le working on it: the developer and me. >>> >>> I maybe stubborn, but i stick with my plan and i pay for it, from my ow= n money, and hope to be able to invest more soon. >>> >>> Any better idea is welcome. >>> >>> - chris >>> >>> On Jan 1, 2012, at 18:02, Kenneth Grome wrote: >>> >>>>> But then I saw the recent email about lack of funds to >>>>> work on the Windows version of WebDNA and the license >>>>> sale/promotion offered and the very real need for >>>>> funding for WebDNA. =A0At that point, it struck me that >>>>> maybe WebDNA was never going to be open source after >>>>> all. =A0Did I miss something? >>>> >>>> Yes, apparently you did. >>>> >>>> No one at WSC ever thought that open source was a wise thing >>>> to do. =A0From the very beginning they have felt that the only >>>> worthwhile asset they own is WebDNA's internal code -- and >>>> they need to prevent others from gaining access it at all >>>> costs. >>>> >>>> Case in point: >>>> >>>> Several years ago while I was still managing an offshore >>>> programming service and WSC had just purchased WebDNA I >>>> proposed to help them develop and release a new version "in >>>> record time" by setting up a special secured office and >>>> personally managing 5 full-time C++ programmers -- all for >>>> less than the cost of hiring one full-time US-based >>>> programmer with the same skill set. >>>> >>>> They rejected my offer because they did not trust me or my >>>> programmers (I'm not sure which, maybe all of us) to have >>>> access to WebDNA's internal code. >>>> >>>> It's been a few years since then. =A0I wonder how WSC's >>>> feelings may have changed? =A0To put it bluntly, if their >>>> attitude remains the same then it seems we have nothing to >>>> discuss. >>>> >>>> Sincerely, >>>> Kenneth Grome >>>> --------------------------------------------------------- >>>> This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to >>>> the mailing list . >>>> To unsubscribe, E-mail to: >>>> archives: http://mail.webdna.us/list/talk@webdna.us >>>> Bug Reporting: support@webdna.us >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------- >>> This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to >>> the mailing list . >>> To unsubscribe, E-mail to: >>> archives: http://mail.webdna.us/list/talk@webdna.us >>> Bug Reporting: support@webdna.us >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------- >> This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to >> the mailing list . >> To unsubscribe, E-mail to: >> archives: http://mail.webdna.us/list/talk@webdna.us >> Bug Reporting: support@webdna.us >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------- > This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to > the mailing list . > To unsubscribe, E-mail to: > archives: http://mail.webdna.us/list/talk@webdna.us > Bug Reporting: support@webdna.us --=20 Dave Stengel http://www.mobilinksoftware.com 209.820.1300 dave@mobilinkpro.com
Dave Stengel
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