Re: FREE Stuff ..
This WebDNA talk-list message is from 2003
It keeps the original formatting.
numero = 47685
interpreted = N
texte = Yes, I understand that a few still cling to the older browsers. And I certainly try to ensure that my code degrades gracefully so that the content and functionality are still presented to those users where possible. Those users usually still use older browsers because they don't know how to change, or even that they can. Other times they are under a company mandate to use obsolete technology, or have ancient hardware. So to clarify, I do not make any claim that the world is perfect and all site visitors use modern browsers, just that it seemed a bit surprising to see a web professional not using one. Your comment ended in a smiley, and mine should have as well, as I was trying to be lightly sarcastic. The issue of standards based code and graceful degradation do not come into play in this situation, though. This site was not so much designed to _not_ work in NN4, as it was that is was simply published with some code errors. Whenever a page is mostly or entirely blank in NN4, I look first at tables. NN4 (and correctly so) does not make assumptions about tables that are incorrectly coded. Looking at the source on the SmithMicro page, I noticed the table error immediately: ...
... This is probably why NN4 displays a blank page. There are a couple of other strange errors. Look at the close of the anchor tag in these examples: 
A special thanks to Redeye Interactive
(A Berlin Productions company)
for their site design assistance. Don't have experience to draw upon as to how NN4 might interpret these errors.Peace, smiley :) and all that.Mike On Tuesday, February 11, 2003, at 09:03 PM, Dennis J. Bonsall, Jr. wrote:>> The roads today are not friendly to Model A Fords, either, but that >> doesn't keep their owners from complaining just the same. >> Netscape 4.x is not a _standards_ compliant browser. Anyone who >> builds >> standards compliant sites will have to build special roads for those >> who insist on browsing in their Model A. Considering that you can get >> your hands on a brand new 2003 model for 0 down and 0% financing and >> no >> payments until ever, I don't understand the rationale. > > My point in this matter is regarding what I think is good technique > when it comes > to building web sites. While I understand that advances in technology > and site > design will leave the older browsers behind, I do not think that that > time is > here. There are still a portion of users that still cling to their > 4.x browsers, > for whatever reason. And, when the purpose of the site is to transact > business, I > think that the site designer should do everything that they can to > make sure as > many people willing to spend money are given the opportunity > (obviously I am not > referring to the SMSI page in question). This is a cost/benefit > analysis > situation. But in a situation where the problem is related to > technologies such as > JavaScript or CSS, I personally think that the developer should create > an HTML-only > version of the pages in question (how much of a cost difference are we > talking here > - $50? $500?). I do not like the sites, for instance, that require > the use of > Javascript to use the shopping cart. I often have JS turned off on my > browser, > because I am sick of pop-up ads. And, of course, when JS is off, CSS > does not > work. I like to use JS and CSS in sites that I develop. But, if the > user has them > turned off, they can still use the site. Most current developers > crank out their > sites using canned code in applications, and test in only one browser. > If it works > in their browser of choice, it must work in all. I check my sites in > 6 different > browsers, with JS/CSS both on and off. > > Dennis > > > ------------------------------------------------------------- > This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to > the mailing list . > To unsubscribe, E-mail to: > To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to > > Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ > > Michael Davis, President Kondooit, Inc. Voice: 503.295.0609 3603 S.E. Sherman St. Fax: 208.361.5696 Portland, OR 97214- Broadband Internet Services http://www.kondooit.com/ Co-Location | Hosting | Fixed Wireless | Web Design ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/
Associated Messages, from the most recent to the oldest:
Yes, I understand that a few still cling to the older browsers. And I certainly try to ensure that my code degrades gracefully so that the content and functionality are still presented to those users where possible. Those users usually still use older browsers because they don't know how to change, or even that they can. Other times they are under a company mandate to use obsolete technology, or have ancient hardware. So to clarify, I do not make any claim that the world is perfect and all site visitors use modern browsers, just that it seemed a bit surprising to see a web professional not using one. Your comment ended in a smiley, and mine should have as well, as I was trying to be lightly sarcastic. The issue of standards based code and graceful degradation do not come into play in this situation, though. This site was not so much designed to _not_ work in NN4, as it was that is was simply published with some code errors. Whenever a page is mostly or entirely blank in NN4, I look first at tables. NN4 (and correctly so) does not make assumptions about tables that are incorrectly coded. Looking at the source on the SmithMicro page, I noticed the table error immediately: ...
... This is probably why NN4 displays a blank page. There are a couple of other strange errors. Look at the close of the anchor tag in these examples: A special thanks to Redeye Interactive
(A Berlin Productions company)
for their site design assistance. Don't have experience to draw upon as to how NN4 might interpret these errors.Peace, smiley :) and all that.Mike On Tuesday, February 11, 2003, at 09:03 PM, Dennis J. Bonsall, Jr. wrote:>> The roads today are not friendly to Model A Fords, either, but that >> doesn't keep their owners from complaining just the same. >> Netscape 4.x is not a _standards_ compliant browser. Anyone who >> builds >> standards compliant sites will have to build special roads for those >> who insist on browsing in their Model A. Considering that you can get >> your hands on a brand new 2003 model for 0 down and 0% financing and >> no >> payments until ever, I don't understand the rationale. > > My point in this matter is regarding what I think is good technique > when it comes > to building web sites. While I understand that advances in technology > and site > design will leave the older browsers behind, I do not think that that > time is > here. There are still a portion of users that still cling to their > 4.x browsers, > for whatever reason. And, when the purpose of the site is to transact > business, I > think that the site designer should do everything that they can to > make sure as > many people willing to spend money are given the opportunity > (obviously I am not > referring to the SMSI page in question). This is a cost/benefit > analysis > situation. But in a situation where the problem is related to > technologies such as > JavaScript or CSS, I personally think that the developer should create > an HTML-only > version of the pages in question (how much of a cost difference are we > talking here > - $50? $500?). I do not like the sites, for instance, that require > the use of > Javascript to use the shopping cart. I often have JS turned off on my > browser, > because I am sick of pop-up ads. And, of course, when JS is off, CSS > does not > work. I like to use JS and CSS in sites that I develop. But, if the > user has them > turned off, they can still use the site. Most current developers > crank out their > sites using canned code in applications, and test in only one browser. > If it works > in their browser of choice, it must work in all. I check my sites in > 6 different > browsers, with JS/CSS both on and off. > > Dennis > > > ------------------------------------------------------------- > This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to > the mailing list . > To unsubscribe, E-mail to: > To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to > > Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ > > Michael Davis, President Kondooit, Inc. Voice: 503.295.0609 3603 S.E. Sherman St. Fax: 208.361.5696 Portland, OR 97214- Broadband Internet Services http://www.kondooit.com/ Co-Location | Hosting | Fixed Wireless | Web Design ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/
Michael Davis
DOWNLOAD WEBDNA NOW!
Top Articles:
Talk List
The WebDNA community talk-list is the best place to get some help: several hundred extremely proficient programmers with an excellent knowledge of WebDNA and an excellent spirit will deliver all the tips and tricks you can imagine...
Related Readings:
[WebDNA] Uploading Specific File Types (2009)
ImageMap (1997)
[WebDNA] WebDNA 7.0 release for the talk-list users (2011)
HELP WITH DATES (1997)
OT: Google image search results (2004)
Looking up two prices in database? (1997)
Version clarification, please ... (1998)
IP lookup tool via tcpconnect (2002)
vs (1997)
Fwd: Problems with Webcatalog Plug-in (1997)
Nav. 4 probs with cart - Serious problem (1997)
Freeze (2003)
[WebDNA] Deliminating encrypted values (2008)
corrupted images (2002)
Shopping cart problem (2003)
Emailer Chokes on bad address (1997)
carriage returns in data (1997)
Re:Has this happened to you? (1997)
WebCat 5 Intranet Question (2003)
WebCat2.0 acgi vs plugin (1997)