Re: [WebDNA] Webdna and CMS
This WebDNA talk-list message is from 2012
It keeps the original formatting.
numero = 108084
interpreted = N
texte = >> My understanding is that the: >> - Controller (C) part is where all the business logic decides that = gets done what will get displayed. >> - Model (M) part is where all the db interaction happens (whether we = are reading or writing records) >> - View (V) part is where we assemble the display output. Views = display static things mixed with chunks of dynamic output that were = handed it by the C (and the C may have been handed some of its data from = an M) >=20 >=20 > That's not exactly how I understand the idea behind MVC, though I = don't claim to understand it exactly. ;-) However, I think it becomes a = more ambiguous idea when it comes to web apps, especially when your web = app combines data and scripting in one engine. Yeah, you are right that there are several flavors of "MVC" floating = around, and it is also more ambiguous when the db language and scripting = language is one entity, ... but for big apps, it may still help keep the = mind clear to "get/save data" in one file (M), decide and assemble = blocks in another (C), and final output in a third (V). Anyway I took = my ideas from Wikipedia, and then Code Igniter (CI) (e.g. these): http://codeigniter.com/user_guide/general/controllers.html http://codeigniter.com/user_guide/general/models.html http://codeigniter.com/user_guide/general/views.html > Historically, the way I understand it, the model contains both the = data layer and business logic. >=20 > The controller handles the transfer of input. >=20 > The view is both input/output (forms and HTML/CSS) >=20 > However, like I said, I think the term leaves some room for an = ambiguous definition when it comes to the web... with the main idea of = making apps more manageable by grouping the different functions of an = application. ('functions', in this case meaning, methods, aspects, of an = app.) exactly! Just save us from spaghetti code! =20 (actually much of my employment over the years has been *primarily = because* of legacy tangled code bases and my staunch stubbornness = (refusal to lose a staring match with) even the most nightmare-inducing = tangled code and make the needed tweaks, but it gets tedious. > I like the idea of keeping a WebDNA page, WebDNA, and having as little = of WebDNA in the actual HTML file/s as possible. Then, for controller, = perhaps all the AJAX stuff is grouped together with unified = input/output.. 100% agree.. the separation of the languages makes it all so much = easier to maintain. >=20 > Also, This is where the idea of the WYSIWYG-like syntax would have = been great (if it would have actually worked right) Yes, for sure.. (I remember I tried that).. but if done well.. even = square brackets are pretty safe from WYSIWYG software and front-end = human designers when it is just one variable [here] and [there]. >=20 > At that point, you'd have just the required (or = whatever that syntax is ;-), and Dreamweaver wouldn't be confused about = it. Too bad that is on the deprecated track and not the fixed track. >=20 > Anyway, sounds like Tom Duke and I will be working on some ideas for = MVC, so it will be interesting to hear/see how sees it as well. Well before you guys go too far, you might want to see what I have = started with.. or vice versa (I wait to see yours). (but I am already = almost done with what i was going to show). -Govinda=
Associated Messages, from the most recent to the oldest:
>> My understanding is that the: >> - Controller (C) part is where all the business logic decides that = gets done what will get displayed. >> - Model (M) part is where all the db interaction happens (whether we = are reading or writing records) >> - View (V) part is where we assemble the display output. Views = display static things mixed with chunks of dynamic output that were = handed it by the C (and the C may have been handed some of its data from = an M) >=20 >=20 > That's not exactly how I understand the idea behind MVC, though I = don't claim to understand it exactly. ;-) However, I think it becomes a = more ambiguous idea when it comes to web apps, especially when your web = app combines data and scripting in one engine. Yeah, you are right that there are several flavors of "MVC" floating = around, and it is also more ambiguous when the db language and scripting = language is one entity, ... but for big apps, it may still help keep the = mind clear to "get/save data" in one file (M), decide and assemble = blocks in another (C), and final output in a third (V). Anyway I took = my ideas from Wikipedia, and then Code Igniter (CI) (e.g. these): http://codeigniter.com/user_guide/general/controllers.html http://codeigniter.com/user_guide/general/models.html http://codeigniter.com/user_guide/general/views.html > Historically, the way I understand it, the model contains both the = data layer and business logic. >=20 > The controller handles the transfer of input. >=20 > The view is both input/output (forms and HTML/CSS) >=20 > However, like I said, I think the term leaves some room for an = ambiguous definition when it comes to the web... with the main idea of = making apps more manageable by grouping the different functions of an = application. ('functions', in this case meaning, methods, aspects, of an = app.) exactly! Just save us from
Spaghetti code! =20 (actually much of my employment over the years has been *primarily = because* of legacy tangled code bases and my staunch stubbornness = (refusal to lose a staring match with) even the most nightmare-inducing = tangled code and make the needed tweaks, but it gets tedious. > I like the idea of keeping a WebDNA page, WebDNA, and having as little = of WebDNA in the actual HTML file/s as possible. Then, for controller, = perhaps all the AJAX stuff is grouped together with unified = input/output.. 100% agree.. the separation of the languages makes it all so much = easier to maintain. >=20 > Also, This is where the idea of the WYSIWYG-like syntax would have = been great (if it would have actually worked right) Yes, for sure.. (I remember I tried that).. but if done well.. even = square brackets are pretty safe from WYSIWYG software and front-end = human designers when it is just one variable [here] and [there]. >=20 > At that point, you'd have just the required (or = whatever that syntax is ;-), and Dreamweaver wouldn't be confused about = it. Too bad that is on the deprecated track and not the fixed track. >=20 > Anyway, sounds like Tom Duke and I will be working on some ideas for = MVC, so it will be interesting to hear/see how sees it as well. Well before you guys go too far, you might want to see what I have = started with.. or vice versa (I wait to see yours). (but I am already = almost done with what i was going to show). -Govinda=
Govinda
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