Re: Ruby on Rails (was Looping Search)
This WebDNA talk-list message is from 2006
It keeps the original formatting.
numero = 66809
interpreted = N
texte = It is not a matter of using a framework or not or to use Openlazlo/Flex. You can use your existing code with Openlazlo/Flex (which in the end mea= ns ou need to rewrite some stuff to make it work with those products). J= ust like you will need to Javascript your way around to make the site wo= rk with Ajax. Still your WebDNA code remains (sort of) the same. A framework is a WAY to organize your code and make it more object orien= ted (depending on the framework). Go over to fusebox.org (I guess) and d= ownload it to see how it work. So far I have not found a framework that I really like. I tried to mimik= Fusebox with WebDNA, but some things did not work out. Most frameworks = use session and client variables which are stored within the server and = not in the browser. To do this with WebDNA would require some use of a t= emporary database plus cookies and so on. So, if you want to develop a system that works like a desktop applicatio= n then start using Flex/Openlazlo/Ajax. If you want to start organizing your code and write once and use everywh= ere then start using a framework (somehow). The first step would be to s= tart developing WebDNA code within functions (which are somehow a "obejc= t oriented" way to organize your code and call it by variables. Some years ago I started to use mainly a index.tpl page that always gets= called and showing what depending on variables and actions. Sort of lik= e fusebox which calls a controller and that controller gets the fuses wi= th the different content.=20 It takes some time to get used to it, but after some time I think it is = worth the effort because it keeps your code lean and clean and when you = are a team developing on the code much clearer to everyone. Of course th= is forces everyone to adore to a concept. Ok, I could go on about this, but don't want to bore anyone :-) Nitai -- eContentPark - Enterprise Asset Management System eServices - The complete SupportSuite eSurvey - Online Questionnaire made easy Redakto CMS - Content Management that simply works ComputerOil=AE AG Neugutstrasse 66 8600 D=FCbendorf / Switzerland Telefon +41 (0)844 44 55 66 info@computeroil.com http://computeroil.com From: Bess Ho [mailto:BessH@USMS.com] To: WebDNA Talk [mailto:WebDNA-Talk@talk.smithmicro.com] Sent: Thu, 06 Apr 2006 21:20:27 +0200 Subject: Re: Ruby on Rails (was Looping Search) May be you can go into detail about advantages of frameworks. Why framew= orks can offer something that RIA can't. -----Original Message----- From: WebDNA Talk [mailto:WebDNA-Talk@talk.smithmicro.com]On Behalf Of nitai@computeroil.com Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2006 12:05 PM To: WebDNA Talk Subject: Re: Ruby on Rails (was Looping Search) But Rubyonrails or Fusebox or alike are frameworks that make you work in= a certain way and are suppossed to make your code more streamlined. OpenLazlo/Flex/Ajax are tools to create Rich Internet Applications that = behave the same like a Desktop application. Mostly they are tight to XML= syntax and can interact with a middleware which connects to a database. I have had (and still are) expiriencing with Flex, but like I said it is= for creating RIA. Nitai -- eContentPark - Enterprise Asset Management System eServices - The complete SupportSuite eSurvey - Online Questionnaire made easy Redakto CMS - Content Management that simply works ComputerOil=AE AG Neugutstrasse 66 8600 D=FCbendorf / Switzerland Telefon +41 (0)844 44 55 66 info@computeroil.com http://computeroil.com From: Bess Ho [mailto:BessH@USMS.com] To: WebDNA Talk [mailto:WebDNA-Talk@talk.smithmicro.com] Sent: Thu, 06 Apr 2006 20:51:33 +0200 Subject: Re: Ruby on Rails (was Looping Search) You are right. Rudyonrails looks pretty good. I am exploring OpenLaszlo.= org that allows plug-n-play AJAX or Flash. It may be even faster to deli= ver the functionality. -----Original Message----- From: WebDNA Talk [mailto:WebDNA-Talk@talk.smithmicro.com]On Behalf Of devaulw@onebox.com Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2006 7:30 AM To: WebDNA Talk Subject: Re: Ruby on Rails (was Looping Search) Using, no. Experimenting, yes. I think John also said he was looking int= o it.=20 I never cared for PHP since that was just another scripting language. PH= P and WebDNA are the same from that perspective. Ruby on Rails is differ= ent though.=20 One issue with Ruby on Rails is that one needs to know/learn Ruby (a lan= guage) and then learn Rails (a framework). Ruby is an object oriented la= nguage -- this is conceptually different from scripting languages in man= y respects.=20 Rails is a framework. It basically sets up convenient places to put part= s of your web application and gives a number of tools that tie the appli= cation to a database and provide some very useful built-in methods that = make creating applications simple and adding features very, very easy. I= t strives to prevent code duplication (write once, use everywhere in you= r app -- they call it DRY for don't repeat yourself).=20 The real kicker is that Rails makes it unbelievably easy to add lots of = nice AJAX type functionality.=20 Given that Rails is a framework, others are using it as a model to creat= e frameworks in PHP, Python and other languages. I haven't seen any effo= rt in WebDNA on this front to build a framework other than storebuilder = and that is more of a generator than a framework that would work for any= application.=20 I was drawn to Rails when I saw some of the screencasts that showed how = easy it was to create a blog for example. That was something that people= on the WebDNA list had talked about putting together as an OS project. = With Rails, a basic blog can be done in about fifteen minutes (assuming = you've invested in the learning curve). Bill -----Original Message----- From: Clint Davis
Sent: Thu, 06 Apr 2006 09:11:24 -0500 To: "WebDNA Talk" Subject: Re: Ruby on Rails (was Looping Search) As a sidenote... Is anyone on the list using Ruby on Rails=3F I don't have any experience= with it, but it's potential is very attractive. On 4/6/06 9:04 AM, "devaulw@onebox.com" wrote: > Back on the data structure, I just read last night about the "acts=5Fa= s=5Ftree" > model method in Rails. That seems like it would work really well to ha= ndle the > self-referential tree structure originally set out. Of course, you'd h= ave to > be using Rails first.=20 ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/
Associated Messages, from the most recent to the oldest:
It is not a matter of using a framework or not or to use Openlazlo/Flex. You can use your existing code with Openlazlo/Flex (which in the end mea= ns ou need to rewrite some stuff to make it work with those products). J= ust like you will need to Javascript your way around to make the site wo= rk with Ajax. Still your WebDNA code remains (sort of) the same. A framework is a WAY to organize your code and make it more object orien= ted (depending on the framework). Go over to fusebox.org (I guess) and d= ownload it to see how it work. So far I have not found a framework that I really like. I tried to mimik= Fusebox with WebDNA, but some things did not work out. Most frameworks = use session and client variables which are stored within the server and = not in the browser. To do this with WebDNA would require some use of a t= emporary database plus cookies and so on. So, if you want to develop a system that works like a desktop applicatio= n then start using Flex/Openlazlo/Ajax. If you want to start organizing your code and write once and use everywh= ere then start using a framework (somehow). The first step would be to s= tart developing WebDNA code within functions (which are somehow a "obejc= t oriented" way to organize your code and call it by variables. Some years ago I started to use mainly a index.tpl page that always gets= called and showing what depending on variables and actions. Sort of lik= e fusebox which calls a controller and that controller gets the fuses wi= th the different content.=20 It takes some time to get used to it, but after some time I think it is = worth the effort because it keeps your code lean and clean and when you = are a team developing on the code much clearer to everyone. Of course th= is forces everyone to adore to a concept. Ok, I could go on about this, but don't want to bore anyone :-) Nitai -- eContentPark - Enterprise Asset Management System eServices - The complete SupportSuite eSurvey - Online Questionnaire made easy Redakto CMS - Content Management that simply works ComputerOil=AE AG Neugutstrasse 66 8600 D=FCbendorf / Switzerland Telefon +41 (0)844 44 55 66 info@computeroil.com http://computeroil.com From: Bess Ho [mailto:BessH@USMS.com] To: WebDNA Talk [mailto:WebDNA-Talk@talk.smithmicro.com] Sent: Thu, 06 Apr 2006 21:20:27 +0200 Subject: Re: Ruby on Rails (was Looping Search) May be you can go into detail about advantages of frameworks. Why framew= orks can offer something that RIA can't. -----Original Message----- From: WebDNA Talk [mailto:WebDNA-Talk@talk.smithmicro.com]On Behalf Of nitai@computeroil.com Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2006 12:05 PM To: WebDNA Talk Subject: Re: Ruby on Rails (was Looping Search) But Rubyonrails or Fusebox or alike are frameworks that make you work in= a certain way and are suppossed to make your code more streamlined. OpenLazlo/Flex/Ajax are tools to create Rich Internet Applications that = behave the same like a Desktop application. Mostly they are tight to XML= syntax and can interact with a middleware which connects to a database. I have had (and still are) expiriencing with Flex, but like I said it is= for creating RIA. Nitai -- eContentPark - Enterprise Asset Management System eServices - The complete SupportSuite eSurvey - Online Questionnaire made easy Redakto CMS - Content Management that simply works ComputerOil=AE AG Neugutstrasse 66 8600 D=FCbendorf / Switzerland Telefon +41 (0)844 44 55 66 info@computeroil.com http://computeroil.com From: Bess Ho [mailto:BessH@USMS.com] To: WebDNA Talk [mailto:WebDNA-Talk@talk.smithmicro.com] Sent: Thu, 06 Apr 2006 20:51:33 +0200 Subject: Re: Ruby on Rails (was Looping Search) You are right. Rudyonrails looks pretty good. I am exploring OpenLaszlo.= org that allows plug-n-play AJAX or Flash. It may be even faster to deli= ver the functionality. -----Original Message----- From: WebDNA Talk [mailto:WebDNA-Talk@talk.smithmicro.com]On Behalf Of devaulw@onebox.com Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2006 7:30 AM To: WebDNA Talk Subject: Re: Ruby on Rails (was Looping Search) Using, no. Experimenting, yes. I think John also said he was looking int= o it.=20 I never cared for PHP since that was just another scripting language. PH= P and WebDNA are the same from that perspective. Ruby on Rails is differ= ent though.=20 One issue with Ruby on Rails is that one needs to know/learn Ruby (a lan= guage) and then learn Rails (a framework). Ruby is an object oriented la= nguage -- this is conceptually different from scripting languages in man= y respects.=20 Rails is a framework. It basically sets up convenient places to put part= s of your web application and gives a number of tools that tie the appli= cation to a database and provide some very useful built-in methods that = make creating applications simple and adding features very, very easy. I= t strives to prevent code duplication (write once, use everywhere in you= r app -- they call it DRY for don't repeat yourself).=20 The real kicker is that Rails makes it unbelievably easy to add lots of = nice AJAX type functionality.=20 Given that Rails is a framework, others are using it as a model to creat= e frameworks in PHP, Python and other languages. I haven't seen any effo= rt in WebDNA on this front to build a framework other than storebuilder = and that is more of a generator than a framework that would work for any= application.=20 I was drawn to Rails when I saw some of the screencasts that showed how = easy it was to create a blog for example. That was something that people= on the WebDNA list had talked about putting together as an OS project. = With Rails, a basic blog can be done in about fifteen minutes (assuming = you've invested in the learning curve). Bill -----Original Message----- From: Clint Davis Sent: Thu, 06 Apr 2006 09:11:24 -0500 To: "WebDNA Talk" Subject: Re: Ruby on Rails (was Looping Search) As a sidenote... Is anyone on the list using Ruby on Rails=3F I don't have any experience= with it, but it's potential is very attractive. On 4/6/06 9:04 AM, "devaulw@onebox.com" wrote: > Back on the data structure, I just read last night about the "acts=5Fa= s=5Ftree" > model method in Rails. That seems like it would work really well to ha= ndle the > self-referential tree structure originally set out. Of course, you'd h= ave to > be using Rails first.=20 ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/
nitai@computeroil.com
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